Basic 1224 questions

[scs]

Do you know the Keihin part number for the ZRX sized intake spigot off the top of your head. I'm trying to dig up my order from Dynoman out of old emails.

they should be 863 spigots (sudco #020-461)
the ones you want if using zx11 boots, would be spigot 32a (sudco #020-439)

[Old-Skule]

they should be 863 spigots (sudco #020-461)
the ones you want if using zx11 boots, would be spigot 32a (sudco #020-439)

Thanks, I won't see the bike again until Saturday, so I'll look at it then. Forgot to mention also, that something in the ignition system crapped out on my first shakedown run out of the neighborhood. Lost all spark, not sure what's loose yet, so that'll be first on my troubleshooting list. Got 17 miles and fizzle.... still I'm just excited to be riding the bike at this point!

[SteddyTeddy]

the reason i ask, is with the nature of your build you'll probably benefit from the zx11 intake boots and larger diameter spigots. if your running stock boots and spigots, more then likely you'll be choking off some of the air flow (when the motor need it most). the zx11 boots and spigots will open up the intake tract to 40.8mm, which is another 4mm's over stock and the opening diameter of the 41's

I don't think you can sqeeze 41's in stock intake boots. I have ZX11 intakes on mine and it's still a VERY tight fit with my shorty spigots. The long spigots (32b) are just a little smaller diameter and fit in much better. The 32b's are 46mm length end to end. The shorties fit the carbs flush up against the intake boots.

[scs]

I don't think you can sqeeze 41's in stock intake boots. I have ZX11 intakes on mine and it's still a VERY tight fit with my shorty spigots. The long spigots (32b) are just a little smaller diameter and fit in much better. The 32b's are 46mm length end to end. The shorties fit the carbs flush up against the intake boots.

here's the part numbers and applications for the 41's, i'm using the 32a's with zx11 boots, looks like your carbs may have the "864's" which would explain why they're tight and short

FCR41

Application Year I.D. Spigot Port Overall Order

Mark O.D. “B” I.D. “A” Length “C” No.

Kawasaki ZX-7 91-95-------864--48mm 41.65mm 18.80mm 020-453
Kawasaki ZX-11C 90-93-----32A--47mm 40.8mm 26mm 020-439
Kawasaki ZX-9R 94-97------32A--47mm 40.8mm 26mm 020-439
Kawasaki ZX-11D 93-01-----32B--47mm 40.8mm 46mm 020-425
Kawasaki ZX-10-------------863--42mm 36.80mm 26mm 020-461
Kawasaki Zephyr/ZRX1200---863--42mm 36.80mm 26mm 020-461

[SteddyTeddy]

Yeah. Can't read them right now without pulling the carbs. The inside diameter is the same as my 32b's but the outside diameter is larger.

[KWICK]

In an ideal world, I would want the spigot to at least be the size of the carb. A little spigot would hurt the carburation...maybe that's why guys have problems with 41's.

[SteddyTeddy]

In an ideal world, I would want the spigot to at least be the size of the carb. A little spigot would hurt the carburation...maybe that's why guys have problems with 41's.

Do you mean the ID? They match up with the bore of the carb body.

[KWICK]

Do you mean the ID? They match up with the bore of the carb body.

If the carb is a 41, and the spigots are smaller, like the list above says most are, that would, imo, be not so good.

[scs]

If the carb is a 41, and the spigots are smaller, like the list above says most are, that would, imo, be not so good.

on fcr41's, (unless you're using zx11 intake rubbers) the inner diameter of the spigot will be 36.8mm (4mm smaller then the carb throat) when using zx11 rubbers, the spigots are 40.8mm (same as the carb throat)

[sillyhillbilly]

I never said the ZZR1200 box was anything special, it's a TPS controlled emission box.

The ZX11D box works great below 4000 rpm. Up top, it's the same as the stocker except for the 1000 higher rev limiter.

have you ever seen the advance specs on it kwick?
its alot larger than stock, total advance is much larger number (40 ish)and it finishes total advance at 7200 rpms,
the stock zrx cdi finishes at 4800 rpm or sum such low number, and doesnt add any more advance for top end,(32.5 degrees) that emmisions crud you keep charning is for part throttle issues, but for an WFO throttle its at the high advance curve just like your zx11 cdi, and to be on point I have seen 12000 rpms on my tach, now I dont know if its acurate since its run off the zzr cdi box, but i have seen 12k many times on the tach, several this past weekend at ES rally.

[KWICK]

The ZRX tach is generally 1000 rpm or so fast up top. SeanS has put up Stock ZRX vs ZX11D curves. I haven't seen a ZZR chart. The mid-range drop in torque is the prob with the TPS equipped boxes. Unplug your TPS and take it around the block, you'll probably like it a bit better in the 3-5k range.

Anyway, this weekend, I racked up three sets of ZX11D carbs I went thru and jetted on a box stock ZRX1200 this weeked to give them a shake down before shipping....all I can say is MY GAWD!!! The throttle response down low is downright incredible. I thought it was just the state of tune of Calista, but this was on a box stock...even a stock header...1200.

I am quite pleased with the performance of this mod. It just plain works!

[Old-Skule]

A little more info on my build.

The bike quit after my initial ride at 17 miles. Turns out the ignition wheel had come loose. No sparks! After tightening everything down, the motor is smoother than ever.

Must have been working loose during my ride, making the top end OK, but the bottom weaker. Right now I've got to say that without a dyno plot curve my web cams no longer feel weaker down low. Got the bike running Saturday and took it out for a spin...

Doing a 10mph uturn at the end of my neighborhood turned into an inadverdent massively crossed up wheelie. Anywhere in first gear over 3000rpms can result in instant wheelies. I did 3 power wheelies starting at 3000 rpms up to 8500 rpms in a row with no issues. A little gas up it comes. 20mph faster and set it down, then gas it again and up it comes, set it down, and then gas it again at 7000 and up it comes. Amazing torque. Maybe below 3000rpm it's suffering but I doubt below that. I'm going to be doing some more carb tuning and will post up a torque curve in coming weeks. But the web cams are freaking awesome so far!

[KWICK]

Funny how when you build a motor with "no torque", it has more.

Calista's head was made huge on purpose to kill the lowend and it has krazy-torque now....go figger.

[Old-Skule]

My motor is so modded it's hard to compare, but I was always wondering about the extra lift in the 263/40b setup. We are talking more lift, and more overlap, but maybe the lift is kicking in at the low end? Countering some of the overlap issues? I'm also degreed at the relatively conservative 104/106 degrees. So we will see how the top end turns out when I do the ignition but it FEELS like it's just starting to run around 9000rpms right now.

[Ben Zeppa]

The ZRX tach is generally 1000 rpm or so fast up top. SeanS has put up Stock ZRX vs ZX11D curves. I haven't seen a ZZR chart. The mid-range drop in torque is the prob with the TPS equipped boxes. Unplug your TPS and take it around the block, you'll probably like it a bit better in the 3-5k range.

Anyway, this weekend, I racked up three sets of ZX11D carbs I went thru and jetted on a box stock ZRX1200 this weeked to give them a shake down before shipping....all I can say is MY GAWD!!! The throttle response down low is downright incredible. I thought it was just the state of tune of Calista, but this was on a box stock...even a stock header...1200.

I am quite pleased with the performance of this mod. It just plain works!

I can hardly wait for the install on my bike. I think that I am going to be a very happy old man! Scared, but happy!

[Elim8U]

what's up?

[skyproj]

OK Guys - thanks to all for your knowledge. One last thing - is it better to run a stock ignition rotor or a +4 with a basic 1224/stock cam setup?

[Ben Zeppa]

I am running the ZX11 ECU conversion kit on my 1224. This kit includes the ZX11 ECU, ignition rotor,double valve springs, and spring base washers. I installed Megacycle Yoshimura ST-1 grind cams too. Pulled the stock carbs and installed KWICK's MoFlo ZX11 carbs and my silver and black hauls ass! The 1224 build cost me some money but it was worth it. If you wanna play, you gotta pay! It's all good though. I get such good gas mileage now the build will cost me nothing. Well, nothing if I can drive the ZRX for the next 200 years!

[sillyhillbilly]

OK Guys - thanks to all for your knowledge. One last thing - is it better to run a stock ignition rotor or a +4 with a basic 1224/stock cam setup?

stock, call Ivan ,
he first started telling about the 1224 kits years ago, when we all were noobies
he did dyno pulls and found the high compression 1224 DID NOT LIKE the advancer, it lowered his power numbers and the word he used was EVERYWHERE,]
once you get into this area, of motor dont run the advance, the motor doesnt like it, especially with the compression bump, have more advance would bring pinging and detonation issues thats ruins a motor
make the rotor match what every cdi you use, zx11, zrx, zzr, or aftermarket( dyna or others) but run an stock, mated timing rotor for the cdi box you select.

[tanner]

took the the 4 advancer off when I went 1224.

[skyproj]

Excellent - no +4 for the 1224. I'll just have to pull it out of the OEM motor and stick it in the spare motor that's in the bike right now.

Oh, this is getting fun

BTW Ben- Which costs more, a turbo'd ZX14 with custom paint OR your rex??

[Ben Zeppa]

BTW Ben- Which costs more, a turbo'd ZX14 with custom paint OR your rex??

Hard to say buddy. Half the fun is building the ZRX that you have in your mind. The money is justified for me but others might not agree. I wanted something really nice and I was willing to spend some money to get it. I did the same thing with my Goldwing and will probably mod out my DR650 too. When you are old, "living", is always looking forward to something and getting yourself really engrossed in your "hobby". Works for me and I am having a great time and livin' large.
Good luck with you build. Hope to see you next year when I get to California. Maybe we can compare notes. You have a really nice bike there. I remember it when it was pretty stock. You have done a good job.

[skyproj]

UPDATE

Made all my decisions - got all the parts and machine work done - passed it all off to my builder. He decided to post a little slideshow on Youtube. For
those that are interested here's the link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gl5KR...eature=channel

And thanks again to all who advised - lots of info, some contradictory, but it made for an informed decision process.

[tanner]

UPDATE

Made all my decisions - got all the parts and machine work done - passed it all off to my builder. He decided to post a little slideshow on Youtube. For
those that are interested here's the link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gl5KR...eature=channel

And thanks again to all who advised - lots of info, some contradictory, but it made for an informed decision process.

wow-that's pretty cool Scott. I bet you're starting to get excited!

[scs]

wow-that's pretty cool Scott. I bet you're starting to get excited!

+1
good stuff!